Answers in Genesis

[davywavy]

Something which has been entertaining me recently is watching the website of Answers in Genesis, a fundamentalist Christian outfit in Kentucky who are building the Creation Museum. The Creation Museum, if you haven't heard of it, is an answer to all those archaeologists, Natural History museums, biologists, historians and other such silly folks who don't necessarily believe in the literal truth of the Creation outlined in the book of Genesis. Within it's walls, you'll find definitive truths about how the world is only around 6000 years old, illustrated with animatronic macquettes of major scenes from history such as Adam and Eve being chased from garden of Eden by a Tyrannosaurus Rex.

If this wasn't entertaining enough (remember that to date they've spent in excess of $20m on this project and the museum isn't even open yet), I naturally flicked over to their jobs page to find out what sort of vacancies were available at the world's foremost animatronic museum of the Pentateuch.
Mostly, the jobs are manual - labourers and support staff - or administrative; i.e. low paid, low responsibility jobs. All the vacancies require the applicant to sign the Answers in Genesis Statement of Faith, a document which outlines that the signatory believes in the literal truth of every word of the Bible (even the bit which says Pi was 3 in Solomon's Temple). All the vacancies demand this, that is, except one: the one which requires a high degree of technical and academic ability - their web programmer.
It's as if the organisers of AIG realise the futility of getting anyone with a postgraduate qualification in a scientific subject to sign up.

What's really depressing about this is how economic power over someone means you can determine their belief structures for them. I can imagine the interviews now:

Interview A
Interviewer: So, Pablo Wetback. To be eligible to become a lavatory attendant on $4:30 an hour you'll need to sign our Statement of Faith, indicating you believe that the world was created in 6 days and the entire world was flooded in the deluge.
Candidate: Si, senor! I sign anything you say! Jos' give me the dollars to pay for medicine for my sick child!

Interview B
Interviewer:So, Tarquin Well-Educated. To be eligible to become a VP of IT on $65,000 an year you'll need to sign our Statement of Faith, indicating you believe that the world was created in 6 days and the entire world was flooded in the deluge.
Candidate: O RLY?

Comments

[tooth-fairy.livejournal.com]

My head is hurting too much - intelligent comment may appear tommorow (possibly)

please comment on this post;

http://tooth-fairy.livejournal.com/683641.html

ta

[jonnyargles.livejournal.com]

Now, they lost me on the great deluge.

At the last count, there are 6,000 species of reptiles, 9,000 birds, 1,000 amphibians and 15,000 separate species on mammals. That's including nocturnal animals, animals which need arctic surroundings, and those who need tropical surroundings - all catered for in a little boat on the Med, by an old man and his wife, and three couples.

Now, I'd buy it from Gilgamesh as a regional flooding, but that's just unfeasable logistically. It doesn't even say "And God gave Noah a Tardis-like boat, and a host of angels with big shovels," which might paper over some of the cracks.

[miss-s-b.livejournal.com]

"And God gave Noah a Tardis-like boat, and a host of angels with big shovels,"

LMAO!!

[davywavy.livejournal.com]

The most likely explaination for the legend of the flood is the breaking of the Bosphorus and the flooding of the Black Sea, about 7200 years ago. It's an image which pops up in many regional histories/myths (Epic of Gilgamesh especially), and must ahve been utterly catastrophic to the people of the region at the time.

[miss-s-b.livejournal.com]

But... but... that CAN'T be right! It's more than 6,010 years ago!

* buries head in Christian Sands *

[rhythmaning.livejournal.com]

And think of all the fungi, bacteria and virus that would have to hitch a ride, too!

[miss-s-b.livejournal.com]

Mostly, the jobs are manual - labourers and support staff - or administrative; i.e. low paid, low responsibility jobs.

In my experience administrative staff do all the boss's work and get none of the credit...

That minor quibble aside: amusing and erudite as ever, young David ;)

There was a guy in the Pinko Lefty Liberal Rag a few days ago claiming to be a scientist AND a creationist, and to have proof of the biblical timeline and things like that. There are some highly amusing letters of refutation in today's edition, as well as a very well-written one accusing certain scientists of falling into the trap of insecure religionists that you and I have so often mentioned (i.e. that it's a pretty poor science that won't stand up to scrutiny or being argued against).

[jonnyargles.livejournal.com]

[davywavy.livejournal.com]

This is what doctors talk about in their spare time. They get together and have evolution parties.

[hiromasaki.livejournal.com]

Chick Tract?

[jonnyargles.livejournal.com]

No; I've just put too much starch in my trousers.

[davywavy.livejournal.com]

Amusing and erudite? Not tiresome spiel? :p

I'm half tempted to write a short story in which Francis Bacon rises from the dead as an avenging revenant and he and the Archbishop of Canterbury go on the rampage, maining all who stand before them.

Post it here if you do:

[miss-s-b.livejournal.com]

http://britishhorrorfilms.co.uk/board/index.php?s=13559db3e3c8a243402076b7b440bd8b&act=SF&f=24

[jonnyargles.livejournal.com]

How about "Francis Bacon and Francis Bacon" - a cop drama starring the gay painter of screaming popes and the philosopher who didn't write Shakespeare. As zombies?

[rhythmaning.livejournal.com]

I have been meaning to post about Our Imaginary Friend (for what else would God be?), but I just can't imagine it.

Hard to picture

[(Anonymous)]

Like physical science, which describes events that we can never observe directly in terms of reassuring peasant metaphors (waves, fields, string) most metaphysics is an attempt to express the inexpressible in cosy, familiar words. There are some noun-like similes in the early bits of the New Testament - shepherd, light, lamb, way, etc - and the famous scene in "The Silver Chair" where the children point helplessly at the lamp and the cat, saying, "it's rather like that, only bigger"; but at root, the metaphors that the human mind seems to find most accessible are stories or parables. ("The Kingdom of Heaven is like a man who owned a vineyard ...")

Admittedly this is strange, and counter-intuitive, because stories always describe a change, something dynamic in time, even when trying to evoke the changeless and infinite. However, that doesn't mean you can't imagine something, but it does show that there's nothing wrong with finding it challenging or difficult.

H

Re: Hard to picture

[rhythmaning.livejournal.com]

But with a lot of the things you describe, others can imagine them AND test them, even if it is mathematical rather than physical.

God can't be tested.

Ooops, is that a lightning bolt heading my way?

Re: Hard to picture

[(Anonymous)]

No, I wasn't describing how the methodology of science works, because obviously that needn't necessarily apply to a metaphysical debate.

What I was trying to to do was to inspire you with some confidence to approach a subject which you evidently find conceptually daunting (metaphysics) by showing how our literal, primate brains have managed to deal with other, daunting concepts such as particle physics and QED by making use of words, pictures, metaphors and stories.

Nobody would claim, for instance, that a "magnetic field" represents an acre of turf that attracts iron filings, but nevertheless we all know what it does and feel more comfortable for being able to put a name and a label to it. What the Biblical fundamentalists do, and which I consider silly and dangerous, is the equivalent of finding a scientific paper referring to a "magnetic field" and mistaking metaphor for literal truth - the equivalent of insisting that there must exist, somewhere, a real magical acre of turf that really does attract iron filings, because the Word says so right here .... and what's more scientists now admit that there really are geographical areas where strange effects like this can be observed! On the other hand, fundamentalists such as Richard Dawkins perform the metaphorical equivalent of claiming that everyone who believes in a "magnetic field" is claiming the physical existence of a magical acre of turf somewhere (the straw man argument), scoffing at it and concluding that because the literal interpretation of the metaphor is ridiculous, there can obviously never be any such thing as a magnetic field at all.

H

[chrisvenus]

You may then be interested in a friends' LJ post. To give some background in an earlier post he said "I discovered there's a whole fruit cluster right here in Portsmouth. They're the Creation Science Movement and even have an exhibit near the Portsmouth Harbour train station. I went to wander by whilst waiting for a computation to run, and had a look. They were shut when I got there, not that I'd have gone in, but there's amazingly little from the outside to tell you that it's not your typical museum but is full of twaddle."

What sort of twaddle you may wonder. Despite himself our brave reporter ventured inside and this is his story....

http://appealtoreason.livejournal.com/77674.html?nc=16

I know you are cynical now but I'm sure the last point that he quotes will sway you for good.

[davywavy.livejournal.com]

If only it wasn't friends only...

[chrisvenus]

You obviously should have more friends then. Lets see if a bit of transcribing will work:

On a whim, I passed by, and found that it was open and that entry was free:


Unfortunately, thinking back, I don't recall seeing Boris. I don't know what New Scientist had to say about it either, but I'd hope it was suitably scathing. I also momentarily wondered how they knew this dinosaur was called Boris, but I guess since people and dinosaurs lived together 6000 years ago someone must have scratched his name on some bit of rock.

Wandering around the (very small, thank goodness) display inside, it was pretty much as claimed on the website. I took a few photos of bits that caught my eye though:


Unfortunately the Anthropic Principle doesn't show that. Any apparent fine tuning is an observation, and not something the Principle shows. It seeks to 'explain' it, and besides, the principle is contentious to say the least, and something that's generally avoided when possible. As for that last sentence, well, it's a big mix of wrong, misleading and stupid, and ignores so many things it's not even funny.

Next,


Wrong. In fact, I have trouble understanding how anyone could think that.

Finally, I came across this argument. I have to say, that whilst the previous arguments were weak, this one is an amazingly strong and well-formed argument, and which to my surprise I have never come across in academic circles.

This is clearly a major concern for modern ideas of abiogenesis and money should be put into researching the impact of food canning processes on philosophical thought without further delay.

[inskauldrak.livejournal.com]

Surely the US constitution has something to say on this?

Interesting though that you should point out the (rather excellent, by the way) relationship between economic power and the ability to enforce views - written almost like a true dialectical matwerialist!

*ducks and runs*

*realises it's too late now*

G'on, what's the scathing comeback? ; )

PS - why aren't you playing Neverwhere?

[davywavy.livejournal.com]

I agree - you have to feel sorry for the mexicans - seventy years under a one party Socialist State has completely fucked up their chances of economic self-determination. It's only since a former Coca-Cola executive was elected in 2000 that economic growth and standards of living in the country have really started to improve.

PS. Because neither the book nor the TV series were very good, so it doesn't attract me at all.

[gwaunquest.livejournal.com]

Haven't any of these people heard of the Babel Fish and Galoophids "That about wraps it up for God".